Originally posted by dirty_martini
because people can just move away from family to a completely different area to start their business
Yes they can, and would be very smart to do so. When looking to start a new business it would be smart to shop around to find the best location for your business, be it in the same town or a totally different region. And considering the crazy alcohol laws that vary from state to state it pays to research the laws of each state and balance that with the competition in that area.
To stake your life savings, hard work, and your family’s future on a new venture and pick a location based upon it being close to your parents house would be a stupid move. |
Originally posted by kp
Originally posted by dirty_martini
because people can just move away from family to a completely different area to start their business
Yes they can, and would be very smart to do so. When looking to start a new business it would be smart to shop around to find the best location for your business, be it in the same town or a totally different region. And considering the crazy alcohol laws that vary from state to state it pays to research the laws of each state and balance that with the competition in that area.
To stake your life savings, hard work, and your family’s future on a new venture and pick a location based upon it being close to your parents house would be a stupid move.
I would just like to point out, my good man, that your head is on fire. |
Originally posted by MilkmanDan
There is no such thing as an "overpriced beer". A beer is worth whatever somebody is willing to pay for it. If you aren’t willing to pay for it, don’t buy it. If nobody is willing to pay that much, the brewer will go out of business.
If that were true, there is no such thing as overpriced anything. All the Hollywood actors (and actresses) deserve their $30 million a movie since we go watch them in the theaters. I realize that isn’t the same, but that is a dumb statement.
I had a really long rant, but decided against it. The point is, yes people will buy overpriced goods (and beer), but it doesn’t mean that they’re happy with it. Business models aside, there’s a point when you’re making 10,000% profit on a beer when you should feel a little guilty taking people’s hard earned money. Yes, it was their choice to buy it, and your passion, but if they’re willing to support you, you don’t need all their money--they’ll buy more in the long run.
/rant
//end drinking
|
|
|
Originally posted by Schroppfy
Originally posted by erway
Originally posted by CaptainCougar
JP is not going through the same aging that RR and LA beers are. They are a great product and cheers to Ron for getting his process down so well, but he can produce a lot more of the vaste majority of his beer than Tomme or Vinnie can of theirs.
Don’t get me wrong, Erway, I ALWAYS appreciate your insider comments on here and I think you are right 99% of the time.
First off, everything of Ron’s is in barrels or spends time in larger wooden vessels, not just several critter beers. Second, Ron has had significant increases in the number of barrels (relatively unnoticed by the cognoscenti here compared to the talk of Vinnie’s and Tomme’s increase in barrels), so Ron has a significant outlay in dollars upfront right there. Third, Ron has serious long term projects - his reserve releases spend anywhere from 12-20 months in barrels, yet cost maybe 4.50 per 12 oz. That is half the cost of RR beers. Dexter is near Ann Arbor so the rents are high, but clearly not as high as California.
I don’t know the exact production figures for Ron’s reserve beers vs. RR Supplication, Depuration and Temptation, but I’ll bet dollars to donuts RR is producing more...
I know Ron is putting everything in barrels, but not nearly as long as RR and LA for the most part. I am sure that he has some really special stuff that he is keeping tucked away, but most of his barrel aged stuff is in there for less than 6 months, some as little as 2 (think that’s what he told me about the wit).
In any case, I don’t mean to take away anything from what he is doing. Great stuff and he deserves all the kuddo’s that we beer geeks can dole out. But they don’t cost as much as say Temptation does because they aren’t being put in fresh charddonay barrels and their not sitting for 18 months. Seems pretty simple to me.
I cannot speak to the reserve stuff that Ron is doing because I have not tried it nor have I seen it in stores. So yeah, I would guess that Tomme and Vinnie are producing more. |
Originally posted by iowaherkeye
Originally posted by MilkmanDan
There is no such thing as an "overpriced beer". A beer is worth whatever somebody is willing to pay for it. If you aren’t willing to pay for it, don’t buy it. If nobody is willing to pay that much, the brewer will go out of business.
If that were true, there is no such thing as overpriced anything. All the Hollywood actors (and actresses) deserve their $30 million a movie since we go watch them in the theaters. I realize that isn’t the same, but that is a dumb statement.
I had a really long rant, but decided against it. The point is, yes people will buy overpriced goods (and beer), but it doesn’t mean that they’re happy with it. Business models aside, there’s a point when you’re making 10,000% profit on a beer when you should feel a little guilty taking people’s hard earned money. Yes, it was their choice to buy it, and your passion, but if they’re willing to support you, you don’t need all their money--they’ll buy more in the long run.
/rant
//end drinking
Rant away. If you’re making 10,000% profit on a beer, good for you. Nobody holds a gun to your head and forces you to buy it. Not sure what it means to be "happy" with it--if something costs X dollars and you’re willing and able to spend X, then why wouldn’t you be happy?
You have a beer that costs $50. There are five people who all want to buy it for $50. You, however, whine to the brewer, and he sells it to you for $25 because you made him feel bad. Who wins here, other than you? The brewer is short $25. The other four people are pissed off because they would have bought it for its original price.
It’s worth what somebody will pay for it. If you’re not willing to pay it, deal with it. Do you go out to restaurants and harangue the waiters because you think their entrees cost too much? Do you yell at car dealers because you think their cars should be cheaper? Do you get upset with other people because you think haircuts, oil changes, or football game tickets cost too much?
If you don’t want to pay it, don’t pay it. You are not owed good beer at a cheap price because it happens to be a hobby you enjoy. Brewers make beer. They set a price for the beer. You either buy it or you don’t. If everybody thinks it’s too pricey, nobody buys it. If enough people think it’s worth the cost, they stay in business.
Now, if you’ll excuse me, I think I need to go to that strip mall near my house to yell at the guy at Subway because I think their subs should be a buck cheaper. |
Tomme Arthur is the last person that needs to justify the price of his beer. The PP/LA brewery in San Marcos is turning out great everyday beers like Sharkbite and Wipeout, the incredibly good value Old Viscosity as well as the more expensive limited release Lost Abbey stuff. The PP brew pubs continue to make a great number of great beers at ’regular’ prices. Can’t think of many other brewing companies that match their quality at such a wide range of prices and styles. |
Originally posted by Styles
Originally posted by beastiefan2k
Originally posted by artusory
Originally posted by JK
I had no idea a corked 750 raised the price of beer so much. Brewers should stop using them and do the Jolly Pumpkin style 750 with a cap.
Unfortunately, the brown 750s that JP uses are no longer available.
I would like to know more
The brown 750’s (capped instead of corked) have been dicontinued by every bottle company that makes them. 1 company told Ron they would still make them if he was willing to put down a down payment, (something outragous, like 40 or 60k or something). Of hand the company I know that use these are, JP, DFH, Cpt. Lawrence, Iron Hill, maybe the Bluegrass company? Can’t remember.
Bottles can still be had in green, but we all know the potential problems they pose. So as of last time I was at JP, Ron wasn’t sure what he was going to do yet.
I am saving these for HB purposes, anybody who wants to save for me, I will trade some beer in return, or whatever we can work out. Know of 1 other RBeerian saving as well. lmk.
whenever this is resolved I would like to know what they are doing. JPs in bombers? would that be so bad? or JPs in liter bottles only. |
|
|
Originally posted by kp
Originally posted by dirty_martini
because people can just move away from family to a completely different area to start their business
Yes they can, and would be very smart to do so. When looking to start a new business it would be smart to shop around to find the best location for your business, be it in the same town or a totally different region. And considering the crazy alcohol laws that vary from state to state it pays to research the laws of each state and balance that with the competition in that area.
To stake your life savings, hard work, and your family’s future on a new venture and pick a location based upon it being close to your parents house would be a stupid move.
Then again, the market for craft beer is much bigger in San Diego than Jackson, MI or bumblefart, IA where it would be even cheaper. |
Originally posted by MilkmanDan
Originally posted by iowaherkeye
Originally posted by MilkmanDan
There is no such thing as an "overpriced beer". A beer is worth whatever somebody is willing to pay for it. If you aren’t willing to pay for it, don’t buy it. If nobody is willing to pay that much, the brewer will go out of business.
If that were true, there is no such thing as overpriced anything. All the Hollywood actors (and actresses) deserve their $30 million a movie since we go watch them in the theaters. I realize that isn’t the same, but that is a dumb statement.
I had a really long rant, but decided against it. The point is, yes people will buy overpriced goods (and beer), but it doesn’t mean that they’re happy with it. Business models aside, there’s a point when you’re making 10,000% profit on a beer when you should feel a little guilty taking people’s hard earned money. Yes, it was their choice to buy it, and your passion, but if they’re willing to support you, you don’t need all their money--they’ll buy more in the long run.
/rant
//end drinking
Rant away. If you’re making 10,000% profit on a beer, good for you. Nobody holds a gun to your head and forces you to buy it. Not sure what it means to be "happy" with it--if something costs X dollars and you’re willing and able to spend X, then why wouldn’t you be happy?
You have a beer that costs $50. There are five people who all want to buy it for $50. You, however, whine to the brewer, and he sells it to you for $25 because you made him feel bad. Who wins here, other than you? The brewer is short $25. The other four people are pissed off because they would have bought it for its original price.
It’s worth what somebody will pay for it. If you’re not willing to pay it, deal with it. Do you go out to restaurants and harangue the waiters because you think their entrees cost too much? Do you yell at car dealers because you think their cars should be cheaper? Do you get upset with other people because you think haircuts, oil changes, or football game tickets cost too much?
If you don’t want to pay it, don’t pay it. You are not owed good beer at a cheap price because it happens to be a hobby you enjoy. Brewers make beer. They set a price for the beer. You either buy it or you don’t. If everybody thinks it’s too pricey, nobody buys it. If enough people think it’s worth the cost, they stay in business.
Now, if you’ll excuse me, I think I need to go to that strip mall near my house to yell at the guy at Subway because I think their subs should be a buck cheaper.
Here’s why whining is the solution:
Someone doesn’t want to pay so much for a bottle of beer that they consider a ripoff.
Someone knows that if they don’t buy the beer, other people still will, and the brewer will never know that they hate them for their overpriced beer.
They want other people to refuse to pay for it, but they won’t.
They figure out that the only thing they can do is complain.
Funny enough, complaining does work sometimes. I don’t encourage it, there’s enough complaining in the world, but consider that for most people it’s not just that they don’t want to pay so much, it’s that they would like to see the products priced more reasonably. Refusing to pay will not help accomplish this. Complaining may (to the appropriate person, of course). |
Originally posted by MilkmanDan
There is no such thing as an "overpriced beer". A beer is worth whatever somebody is willing to pay for it. If you aren’t willing to pay for it, don’t buy it. If nobody is willing to pay that much, the brewer will go out of business.
This is an absurd comment. So you won’t mind when the price of gas continues to rise to $5, $6, $10(K + OT)?? People will pay for it... it’s not over-priced. Rubbish. Gas is slightly more of a necessity than beer but things most certainly can be overpriced, and there are things called morals and ethics that say you should not mark your beer up 10,000%. Just because you can do something does not mean you should.
That being said, I do not think $30 for a very limited release beer is that absurd if there is actually a lot of time and effort going into the beer. However, when your standard release beers begin escalating in price then I see a problem, and consumers absolutely should let brewers know how they feel about it. |
