Buying/selling/trading/giving away used tap handles; thoughts?

Reads 24582 • Replies 31 • Started Sunday, December 27, 2009 7:02:31 PM CT

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Message Cletus beers 6349 º places 233 º 19:02 Sun 12/27/2009 This discussion was going on in the beer trade forum, but it is really an industry question, so I’m continuing the discussion here: Originally posted by Eyedrinkale Originally posted by Cletus Originally posted by Eyedrinkale I’m just making people aware that there are lots of costs associated with tap handles. Of course if you got them from the brewery, to you. Happy Holidays. So, if I find a bar that is sitting on a box of tap handles that they no longer use, I shouldn’t ask for them? Just curious, Mike since tap handles are a significant part of BCCA collecting and have been for about 50 years. There are a lot of breweriana collectors out there and in 15 years, this is the 1st time I’ve ever heard of anyone tied to the industry implying that tap handle collecting is taboo. That is exactly what I am saying. The exception of course are breweries that are no longer in business or have in fact pulled out of the market. We encourage our sales people to ask the bar owners for handles they are no longer using. We have even gone as far as to buy them back from bar owners. Bars & restaurants get handles for free and feel as though these are their property. This is a problem in the industry and I know some people are lobbying to have deposits put on handles. That is our position from the distribution side and I’d love to hear from someone on the brewing side that can chime in their position. I’ve had 100s of tap handles given to me (not sold to me) from brewers/breweries that either discontinued a particular tap handle, closed, or pulled out of the area. I know literally 100s of people who I regularly trade tap handles with. I posted your post on the rev.collecting board and their reaction was literally, "what the fuck is he talking about?" Most tap handles in private collections are either bought from the brewery, beaten to hell and rendered useless, or discontinued, so I really don’t see where you’re coming from, but if you think a deposit will solve whatever issues you are having, go for it.
Message Cletus beers 6349 º places 233 º 19:15 Sun 12/27/2009 Originally posted by cquiroga Should we gear up for another shining Cletus moment? Are you really that full of yourself that you have to post a snarky comment in a thread you don’t know a damn thing about? Mike is a friend of mine and both of us were hoping to get an opinion from a brewer on the subject. Brewers do not look at the trade forum so I posted it here. That is all. I don’t have a strong opinion on the subject. I collect older tap handles, as in these: http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-6294-2978-0/1?PID=2012098&AID=10381315&SID=ratebeerebay0606&loc=http%3A%2F%2Fcgi.ebay.com/Minnesota-DULUTH-BREWING-KARLSBRAU-Tap-Handle-Ball-Knob_W0QQitemZ140369346754QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item20aeaa40c2#ht_500wt_968
Message puzzl beers 3259 º places 138 º 19:30 Sun 12/27/2009 I can’t speak for Mike as I don’t work in the industry, and I can’t speak for John as I don’t collect handles, but it is an undeniable fact that these handles we see cost a decent amount of money, and if brewers continue to lose handles for every few kegs they sell then the cost of the handle ends up being included in the cost of the keg, and the consumer is the one that ends up paying. Just basic economics, there. It may not be as set in stone as "consumers or bars should never own tap handles, ever" but John’s line of thought that seems to be that taking tap handles is almost a right is clearly out of line. John, do you feel it is your right to steal a glass after you’ve had a beer served to you in one? I see little difference here. We’ve all done it, but that doesn’t suddenly make it OK.
Message Shyam places 7 º 19:35 Sun 12/27/2009 just a question. do the people who give you or sell you the handles own them? if so, even if industry people don’t like it, it doesn’t seem like there is anything wrong with it.

Message Cletus beers 6349 º places 233 º 19:36 Sun 12/27/2009 Originally posted by puzzl It may not be as set in stone as "consumers or bars should never own tap handles, ever" but John’s line of thought that seems to be that taking tap handles is almost a right is clearly out of line. Just to clarify my earlier point, Andy, I do not collect new tap handles. The only new tap handles I have were given to me as gifts from brewers, bought from a brewery, or a gift from distributors or bigger bars in the area. My analogy pertained to older tap handles. I didn’t even know people were "stealing" tap handles that are still property of the brewery or distributor, which is why I"d like to hear from other folks in the industry about this.
Message Cletus beers 6349 º places 233 º 19:37 Sun 12/27/2009 Originally posted by puzzl John, do you feel it is your right to steal a glass after you’ve had a beer served to you in one? I see little difference here. We’ve all done it, but that doesn’t suddenly make it OK. I’ve never done this. The only thing I’ve ever taken from a brewpub or bar without asking is a coaster or paper placemat.
Message puzzl beers 3259 º places 138 º 19:42 Sun 12/27/2009 Originally posted by Cletus I didn’t even know people were "stealing" tap handles that are still property of the brewery or distributor, which is why I"d like to hear from other folks in the industry about this. That is what Mike is talking about. The distributor gets handles from a brewery, gives them to a bar with a keg, then never gets the handle back. A good chunk of them end up on the walls — we’ve all seen the bars that have hundreds of handles lining the perimeter — and the rest, who even knows; they probably end up just sitting somewhere wasted, never to be used again.
Message cquiroga beers 371 º places 11 º 20:08 Sun 12/27/2009 This doesn’t seem too different from the situation that breweries/beer stores constantly deal with regarding consumers who have "purchased" kegs of beer to-go, and the resultant confusion among naive/ignorant people who think they actually purchased the METAL KEG as well as the beer inside. Obviously, many breweries/stores have gotten wise to the problems and implemented a required deposit to go along with the "keg cost." There’s a bit of a difficult transition during the immediate aftermath of implementing that deposit, but after everyone involved gets used to the practice, I think it’s really the only safe way that some small breweries can defray their costs to the end users who are holding their property in limbo like that. Another way to look at it (which, I guess, is how the "NO-deposit system" works now) is that brewers send out tap handles to distributors or direct sale to bars as a promotional tool of their own-- the brewery gains name recognition and advertising "value" out of having their tap handle on display where their beer is being served-- and if that handle goes missing or the account gets closed or whatever, they just lost the physical handle as a "cost of doing business." But yeah, ultimately, those costs are just going to get rolled back into their keg costs, one way or another. . . I guess I agree that if you didn’t receive it from a brewery or from someone who received it from a brewery, it’s kind of a dick thing to buy/trade/sell/give it away. But anyone who has ever traded any beer here that is not distributed legally in their area is arguably committing just as heinous an offense. . ..

Message matta beers 1140 º places 91 º 20:11 Sun 12/27/2009 I can tell you as a distributor that works with more than 50 craft brewers and specialty importers... The loss of tap handles is a major issue and the consumer ends up paying for it in the end. This is a problem for every distributor and brewery I know... and a constant issue.
Message Cletus beers 6349 º places 233 º 20:28 Sun 12/27/2009 Originally posted by matta I can tell you as a distributor that works with more than 50 craft brewers and specialty importers... The loss of tap handles is a major issue and the consumer ends up paying for it in the end. This is a problem for every distributor and brewery I know... and a constant issue. Is there a reason why a deposit isn’t being charged like there is with kegs if this is a widespread issue? I remember when idiots were stealing expensive half barrel kegs to turn them into brew kettles and that the response to that was higher deposit prices. Also, is there a way to determine which handles are being sold against the brewer/distributor’s wishes? This is something I’d potentially write an article on for a future BCCA newsletter if I can get some concrete facts on the subject. No one I know is interested in screwing over breweries since all of us are beer lovers first and foremost.
Message legion242 beers 2345 º places 122 º 20:33 Sun 12/27/2009 Originally posted by matta I can tell you as a distributor that works with more than 50 craft brewers and specialty importers... The loss of tap handles is a major issue and the consumer ends up paying for it in the end. This is a problem for every distributor and brewery I know... and a constant issue. Come on now. We both know that these handles are "disposable". I have worked for many breweries and never has a word come up about where they end up. In fact, anyone can BM about my collection of unused handles in my garage. If I have so many, surely no gave a damn about them. Add to to that shirts, banners, even 18-wheeler mud flaps!!!